The future of DS gaming: 3rd party publishers taking it more seriously?

[ASR]

I was among the first to get Call of Duty 4 DS when it came out if only because my younger brother is quite literally obsessed with the series on XBOX. I was really interested in seeing how a true FPS would be handled on the DS, and was very pleased with the result.

The graphics were top-notch, especially the first (second, I guess) level out at sea on the rainy ship. Not only was the environment slowly rocking, but it was raining, there was lightning, and it all looked great.

I've never been one to let graphics "make" my game, but in this case, they played quite a major part in how much I liked it. On top of it, they were very successful in "pioneering" the FPS genre for DS. Although it took a little while to get used to, it was done just right and it made for a great game. Appropriate touch-screen usage, too.

I'm also well aware of Dementium, and I have played it, and that game, too, made good use out of the FPS genre on DS. It ran quickly and well, but it was a bit cheesy and had the same problem as Doom 3 - flashlight OR gun, but never both. Still a decent game.

Now, with titles like Assassin's Creed coming just within the next two months, it's really nice to see that more effort is being put into the larger, more reputable hardcore games of the console generations and their conversions to the DS format. Hell, PSP didn't even get a Call of Duty 4 game.

I'm really interested in Assassin's Creed, though. No information or screenshots have been revealed yet, and it's due for release February 2nd.

[Abominator]

...and yet somehow you think it'll be good, despite the complete lack of publicity and the console game that it's based on being trash.

Anyway, people have been making "serious" DS games all along.

[ASR]

Bad choice of wording - I didn't have enough room in the thread title to express what I meant, and I still don't really have the right words to do so. Mainly because I normally don't think too highly of these games, but I'm talking more like next-gen 3D games that already made their name on consoles.

And I didn't say I think Assassin's Creed DS will be good, I know absolutely nothing about it as of right now. However, I see nothing wrong with the console version.

[TheRedPriest]

The DS doesn't excell in 3D, but it can do some decent looking stuff.  And if your definition of the DS getting "serious" games is that they be in 3D, please go eat a dick.

The DS has had and does have a solid library with "serious" games.  I don't know where you're comming from on this.

[ASR]

Definitely not what I meant, it came out wrong.

I can't describe what I'm getting at much more than I already did... I mean, more like the types of games that the DS normally doesn't attract. Things like FPS's and more in-depth 3D games (not platformers.)

That right there is a pretty good description, actually.

Let's just dismiss the odd usage of the word "serious."

[Johncarllos]

They are expanding the DS games to more genres and are really starting to push the DS to it's limits.

[TheRedPriest]

A sign the DS is approaching legendary status.  Now it just needs more RPGs...

[ASR]

You'd think it would have an enormous library of them by now. There's still enough to keep most people occupied, though.

[NovaMan XP]

I think the only RPG I have for the DS is Star Force...

*vomits*

[Mikero]

Nah there's some others. I don't know if they're any good. But there's like Children of Mana and some thing that's related to Boktai and others. They're an add for them every now and then in comics.

OH! This week the first issue of "Teen Titans: Year One" came out, and in one scene Kid Flash is extremely bored after waiting a WHOLE minute for an IM from Robin and it shows him running around trying to kill his boredom. In one part he's playing a DS.

I can't describe what I'm getting at much more than I already did... I mean, more like the types of games that the DS normally doesn't attract. Things like FPS's and more in-depth 3D games (not platformers.)

Essentially not a bunch of puzzle and memory games.

[ASR]

As great as they (puzzle/memory games) are, or rather can be, that's another good point.

[Kamon]

Nah there's some others. I don't know if they're any good. But there's like Children of Mana and some thing that's related to Boktai and others.

You mean Lunar Knights?

[ASR]

I'll see how many DS RPG's I can name off the topic of my head without including Star Force, a disgrace all on its own:

- Final Fantasy 3
- Pokemon Diamond/Pearl
- Final Fantasy XII Revenant Wings
- Children of Mana
- Lunar Knights
- Digimon World DS (a bunch of them)
- Lost in Blue (is it an RPG?)
- Dragon Quest Monsters Joker
- Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time

There's gotta' be a few more.

[NovaMan XP]

Oh yeah, I got Pokemon too. Forgot about that.

Which would you say is the best out of that list, ASR?

[ASR]

The only one on that list that I've played for more than an hour is Mario & Luigi.

So, uh, that one?

[Vinchenz Rock]

I've played most of the RPGs listed in ASR's post, so I'll rank them for you, Nova:

- Dragon Quest Monsters: Joker - Everyone should buy this, especially if you're a fan of the Gameboy games.
- Final Fantasy XII: Revenant Wings - A lot better than I expected. An original TRPG.
- Final Fantasy III - Pretty good, though the original for the NES was better.
- Pokemon Diamond/Pearl - Meh, I really lost interest in Pokemon by this game.
- Children of Mana - Too repetitive.
- Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time - UGH. Horrible, especially how awesome the GBA game is.

[TheRedPriest]

Right, let's clarify what an RPG is shall we?

Final Fantasy 3 is an RPG.  Pokemon is not.
Breath of Fire 2 is an RPG.  Starforce is not.
Super Mario RPG is an RPG.  Lost in Blue is not.

See where this is going?

DS has very few RPGs.

[Mikero]

Nah there's some others. I don't know if they're any good. But there's like Children of Mana and some thing that's related to Boktai and others.

You mean Lunar Knights?

Yeah.

[Vinchenz Rock]

Right, let's clarify what an RPG is shall we?

Final Fantasy 3 is an RPG.  Pokemon is not.
Breath of Fire 2 is an RPG.  Starforce is not.
Super Mario RPG is an RPG.  Lost in Blue is not.

See where this is going?

DS has very few RPGs.

See now, you're thinking about turn based RPGs. Final Fantasy 4-9 are RPGs and not ATBRPGs. Using the term "RPG" now-a-days generally mean games that have battles, leveling up and multiple characters.

And while Lost in Blue isn't an RPG, Pokemon is. If you want to get more specific, though it's a One-On-One RPG.

[Zenaku]

DQM:J was good if you could get into the whole THIS IS A J-RPG YOU MUST GRIND AND GRIND.

I wouldn't say the FF12 game should be considered RPGs as they are more akin to strategy than RPGs.

[Kamon]

Nah there's some others. I don't know if they're any good. But there's like Children of Mana and some thing that's related to Boktai and others.

You mean Lunar Knights?

Yeah.

Lunar Knights didn't feel like an RPG. Sure it has RPG elements, but it's primarily a top-down action game like Boktai. Isn't it?

[White Shadow]

See now, you're thinking about turn based RPGs. Final Fantasy 4-9 are RPGs and not ATBRPGs. Using the term "RPG" now-a-days generally mean games that have battles, leveling up and multiple characters.

Which killed a whole genre. Good job.

Children of Mana is about as much an RPG as Diablo is. Which means not at all. Remember the RP in RPG? Stands for Role-Playing. I'm afraid this only qualifies games for the category that have some kind of character. That's why Zelda and Pokemon games aren't RPGs.

[ChaosVortex]

Call me stupid, but I still consider Pokemon to be RPG-ish, but that's only because you level up PokeMon and have a party.

Zelda has RPG elements, but is an action adventure game just like 3D Mario or Banjo.

[TheRedPriest]

See now, you're thinking about turn based RPGs. Final Fantasy 4-9 are RPGs and not ATBRPGs. Using the term "RPG" now-a-days generally mean games that have battles, leveling up and multiple characters.

What White Shadow said.  RPG has been watered down so much it's used to describe a game that isn't an RPG at all.

RPGs have in general ALL of the following:
1) An epic plot the player guides a party of many people through which he controles in turn based or (in rare cases that actually WORK since you have multiple characters) real time battles.

2) Your party gets experiece points and money from battle.  By leveling up a wide number of stats change and you learn new powers. 

3) You can buy weapons, armor, accessories, magic for your party and equip them. 

4) Level will, for the most part, dictate when you can fight bosses/progress in the game and will require some amount of grinding to level your party up enought to not die.

Adventure games these days will, for the most part, have some form of RPG element in them to add "depth".  This does NOT make the game an RPG.  And the fact people are retarded enough to call it an RPG when it's NOT along with Online "RPGs" are what is slowly but surely killing the genre.

And while Lost in Blue isn't an RPG, Pokemon is. If you want to get more specific, though it's a One-On-One RPG.

Pokemon is not, nor was it EVER an RPG.  It's a monster collecting game.  Other than leveling up your monsters, it has nothing in common with what makes an RPG.  If I were to ask for an RPG for Christmas and received a Pokemon game, I would have to shank that person in the face with a knife I'd make from the plastic game case it came in.

[Abominator]

RPGs are just like videogames, but with all the fun removed and numbers put in.

[ASR]

I never play RPG's anymore, and I think I've reverted into a casual gamer. I like that. Don't have time for all that RPG stuff nowadays.

[Mikero]

Nah there's some others. I don't know if they're any good. But there's like Children of Mana and some thing that's related to Boktai and others.

You mean Lunar Knights?

Yeah.

Lunar Knights didn't feel like an RPG. Sure it has RPG elements, but it's primarily a top-down action game like Boktai. Isn't it?

I guess. I haven't played it but they said in the ad either RPG or Action Adventure. Probably the latter but if I don't play a game or see it in action and it's a top-down I generally assume it's an RPG. That's dumb but it's not on purpose or anything.

[Kamon]

I can understand that. Lunar Knights plays like a lot like Boktai 2, so I'd say...Action/Adventure.

[Johncarllos]

I like Tales games as RPGs, the real time battle work great and it's not too boring. More skill and less luck needed in the battles.

[Rahvin]

I'll see how many DS RPG's I can name off the topic of my head without including Star Force, a disgrace all on its own:

- Final Fantasy 3
- Pokemon Diamond/Pearl
- Final Fantasy XII Revenant Wings
- Children of Mana
- Lunar Knights
- Digimon World DS (a bunch of them)
- Lost in Blue (is it an RPG?)
- Dragon Quest Monsters Joker
- Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time

There's gotta' be a few more.

Etrian Odyssey
Rune Factory
That crappy Lunar game
That's all I can think of really...

[Vinchenz Rock]

Pokemon is not, nor was it EVER an RPG.  It's a monster collecting game. 

Sorry, I was thinking of the battle system alone, I didn't take the whole monster thing into considerate. x_x

The battle system is a One-On-One turn based system. Though, I think the orignal PKMN Red and Blue games were considered RPGs until the Monster Collection genre was made.

[Mikero]

Yes they were but based solely on it being top down and including exp points/levelling and a sort of party, when that's only part of what it's about.